Heroes, Zeros, and Geniuses #2 Lights Out (Dec 8)

Heroes, Zeros, and Geniuses in the Jodi Arias Case #2 Lights Out

The Jodi Arias Murder Trial: The Other Side of the Story


Fact – Based Reporting by

Rob Roman and Amanda Chen

Well folks, we now know that Jodi’s motion to dump her lead attorney was denied. The defense motions for a change of venue and individual voir dire (questioning) of the jury were also denied. The motion to obtain the Twitter handles of jurors was denied and the defense motion to sequester the jury was denied.
batmanJust a few days ago (Dec. 5), renewed motions again asking for a change of venue and individualized voir dire were denied again.
Judge Sherry Stephens has now officially become the Queen of Denial. We can call her Cleopatra. It seems the motion to move in slow motion was granted.
Jury selection is imminent, and the trial is scheduled to begin sometime in mid-February, 2014.
A motion to limit media coverage was granted. It’s lights out for the 2nd penalty phase. We will have to depend on the few reporters who will be inside the courtroom.
So, it’s time for another Heros, Zeroes, and Geniuses segment. We have some from the original penalty and guilt phases as well as some current treasures, in both the normal and ironic senses of the word.

Hero #1

court cameras

Courtroom Cameras

Cameras will still be in the courtroom, however, and we will be able to watch the trial after it’s over. The entire original trial exists on YouTube and other internet sites for everyone to see. It’s your decision whether this was a fair or unfair trial. We say “No way, Jose!”
When hearing reports in the second penalty phase, it’s important to realize just who is doing the reporting and whether what is being reported is factual, or biased speculation. If the person making the report just happens to be hawking their latest book about Jodi Arias at the same time (like Josh Hoffner, the author of “Killer Girlfriend”), be cautious.
This is the guy who claimed he had a “stare down” with Jodi Arias in the courtroom, even though Jodi probably had no idea who he was and was just wondering who this man was who had appeared on her side of the courtroom. This Associated Press Journalist with lots of experience went on CNN’s headline news, but tellingly, had nothing other than that to report as he hawked his equally speculative book about the killing.

Hero #2


Donavan Bering

Also on Jodi’s side of the gallery almost every day of the trial was Jodi’s jailhouse friend, Donavan Bering. If the chips are down, and the whole world is against you, this is the friend you would want.
Ms. Bering was one of the few guests talking to reporters in support of Jodi Arias. She was a guest on CNN’s Headline News studio a few times, where she reportedly burned the house down!
Sorry, Donavan, just joking. Donavan showed a rare phenomenon in a friend known as loyalty, and she stuck by Jodi’s side through hell and high water.
Now free on parole from an arson conviction, Donavan, was absolutely vilified and lambasted by the media, for being nothing but a good and true friend. The world needs more people like Ms. Bering, who by many accounts is a really nice and caring person.

Hero #3

jennifer willmott lt

Jennifer Willmott

Not nearly enough attention was given to the truly heartfelt and heroic closing statements delivered by Arias’ 2nd chair attorney, Jennifer Willmott form the original penalty phase.
Just listen to it one more time (below).  This was a visceral and heart-felt plea for sparing the life of Jodi Arias. Ms. Willmott may have been responsible for the 4 jurors who would not back down on their votes for life.
When you have a tragedy, especially with Arias’ circumstances of good character, nothing more than a traffic ticket, and a lifelong mental illness, you try to salvage what is left from the tragedy. You don’t throw a person’s life away on the basis of what’s been presented in this case. Execution still hangs over Jodi Arias’ head, and it will be interesting to see which defense attorney does the closing arguments this time.

Zero #1

troy hayden brt

Troy Hayden (Fox News Phoenix)

and Ryan Owens (ABC correspondent)

This man is the Fox News reporter located in Phoenix, who interviewed Jodi Arias after the guilty verdict (see the video below). What Jodi said in this interview was the reason why she was confined to the jail psychiatric unit for 3 days after the guilty verdict (risk of being a danger to self). His interview was very fair, compared to the interview from Ryan Owens, an ABC correspondent.
ryan owensRyan Owens lied to Arias when he agreed not to show Jodi’s prison stripes or leg chains, as a condition of the interview. His reasoning was he didn’t have to abide by this agreement because it was made with Jodi Arias. Ryan Owens aggressively attacked Arias in the interview, demanding of Arias ‘When are you going to finally tell us what really happened in that bathroom?
 Jodi spent a lot of time under oath explaining what happened in the bathroom. What really didn’t happen in that bathroom is what the prosecution says happened, because the forensic and crime scene evidence contradicts their theory.
Last week, Troy Haden reported that he had interviewed a former cell-mate of Jodi’s who claims Arias wanted to know why Juan Martinez doesn’t love her and that Arias threatened to have Juan Martinez killed by way of “Mafia Bow tie”  or slit throat.
We became immediately suspicious because
super heroA)    No details were provided such as when was this said? Where was this said, under what circumstances was this said? How long was she cell-mates with Arias?
B)    No details were given about this cell-mate such as what was her crime, what is her current status, etc.
C)    No other statements were given from the former prisoner, besides the derisive statements about Arias. What else happened while the two were cellmates? Are there any positive things that happened?
No real reporter could take this report seriously. Yet all the major outlets and all the most popular blogs, and all the social media parroted it like it was gospel.
Few people reported any facts at all about this prisoner, who appeared to be quite obviously mentally ill.
Since there is now a media blackout, the media will be dependent on the reporters who are actually in the courtroom and viewing the trial live. So, it’s no small wonder what Troy Hayden was trying to do. Troy Hayden is another opportunist who wanted to get a scoop so he could set himself up as the go-to guy for the 2nd penalty phase. It’s really that simple.

Zero #2

nancy grace

Nancy Grace

At least we know Nancy Grace is not liked by people on all sides of this case, regardless of her odes to the fallen heroes in Afghanistan.
Nancy Grace  did everything in her power to incite the lynch mob against Jodi Arias, including declaring her guilty of premeditated murder a few days into the trial, because Travis was stabbed in the back. Actually, the stabs in the back may actually be defensive blows made by Arias while under or face to face with Travis Alexander. The description, shape and pattern of these wounds are much less likely to be made in an offensive manner as they would in a defensive manner.
zerosNancy was much more fair to Brett Seacat (fair trial – guilty – private legal team) and Dr. Martin MacNeil (fair trial – guilty –  private legal team). See if you can spot the differences.
The good news is that CNN and Headline news are now under a shake-up due to low ratings. The new boss has promised that CNN and HLN will be unrecognizable in 2014 from what they are now .
We hope this means Nancy grace will lose her show and get the old Heave-Ho. We are tired of watching her be rude to guests who disagree with her, hang up on them, talk over them, or disconnect them in mid-talk as she has done to Beth Karas and others so many times.

Zero #3

sheriff joe

Sheriff Joe Arpaio

Jodi Arias reported that a toilet near her cell was running continuously and yet no staff did anything about it for days. These are people who are supposed to notice stuff like that. So, it’s small wonder that other prisoners at the jail have cried and screamed for basic medical attention and nobody ever came around, after which they needed to be hospitalized and some died in their cells.
japanese zeroJoe made our list by reducing visiting hours just in time for the holiday to .5 hours per week (probably to save on overtime). Sheriff Joe also took all meat out of the prisoner’s meals to save money. He boasted that he had gotten Thanksgiving dinner down to a cost of just 60 cents per meal. Way to go, Joe!
Joe is such a good, frugal money saver, especially in election years in Arizona. So allow me to mention this fact from Wikipedia:
There have been two thousand lawsuits and the 43 million dollars in payouts against Sheriff Joe.  That’s “50 times as many prison- conditions lawsuits as there were in New York City, Los Angeles, Chicago, and Houston jail systems combined” (Sources: Wikipedia and AZCentral.com).
For a guy who sure can save that money, you sure are losing a damn awful lot of money. Say it ain’t so, Joe!

Genius #1

cassandra collins brt

Cassandra Collins

Okay, look at this hairdo and look at the facial expression. I don’t mean to be judgmental, but this was immediately indicative of mental illness, having worked in this field.
But that didn’t stop Troy Hayden from broadcasting every inflammatory word this woman had to say about Jodi Arias, including that Jodi Arias allegedly posed for Cassandra naked with her buttocks jacked up like she was in that famous photo that Travis took, and asked Cassandra “Does this look forced to you?”
Readers who know the facts later determined that Cassandra Collins was Jodi Arias’cell mate sometime in 2009.  If we wanted to research this for consistency and reliability, a good reporter would get the month and date these supposed things happened and see if they match up with testimony given in pre-trial hearings, etc.
sherry stephensJodi Arias denies this account. She also denies that she threatened to have prosecutor Juan Martinez killed if she received the Death Penalty, by way of a “Mafia Bow tie”.
A “mafia bow tie” is not listed in the urban dictionary at all, and is nothing but an actual bow tie. A Columbian or Mexican Neck tie, is when someone slits a victim’s throat and pulls their tongue through the slit, as a message to rivals.
Although, this was mildly amusing, few people reported the fact that Cassandra Collins was found to be incompetent to stand trial (not mentally capable of understanding the difference between right and wrong). Not only that, she was adjudicated as being “not likely to become competent any time in the near future”.
How do we know this? Jodi’s proxy tweeted the court records out on Twitter.
Did Jodi get naked and up close and personal to get Cassandra the hell out of her cell? I wouldn’t blame her. Most likely, Cassandra made the whole thing up because she wanted to ride on the Jodi train.
Good luck Cassandra in your future pursuits (of fame).

Genius #2

Metallic Twitter Logo

Twitter Twits in the Twitterverse

I always want to check on what facts and relevant information the Prosecution Supporters are working on. Here is what I found:
Terri Stefaniw ‏@TerriStefaniw
#jodiarias Twas the night b/4 xmas, and all through “the House”, every jailguard is glowing cause Hodi’s been blowing.
– That’s not nice!
Jtwitter 1effrey Evan Gold ‏@jeffgoldesq
#JodiArias asked court to reconsider change venue & individual juror Qs motions in light of @troyhaydenfox10 interview with cellmate: DENIED
Favorited 13 times
– In light of Troy Hatden’s childish report. No self-respecting reporter would ever have submitted such trash, but in the case of Jodi Arias, all’s fair, I guess.
There’s #jodiarias again! #lotlizard @JodiAnnArias pic.twitter.com/wgpK9CN6Sg
jodi truck stop brt
– This one is quite self-explanatory.
twitter 2Morning Express ‏@MorningExp 3 Dec
Could alleged #JodiArias revenge plot impact the final phase of her murder trial?? http://on.hln.tv/52ozvO
– Why should it? It’s not credible. It’s being investigated by both the defense and the prosecution, so we will be hearing more about this. If she did this, bring her up on charges! You never will, because it’s ridiculous.
Nancy Grace ‏@NancyGraceHLN 8 Nov
I guess the #MartinMacNeill defense team took a page out of the #JodiArias playbook & decided taking the stand was a big no-no
– Martin MacNeil was not claiming self-defense, where a defendant is obligated to take the stand, in most cases..
geniusTeri ‏@Teri423 13m
@nuts2beanz @TerriStefaniw @JodiAnnArias There is nothing that will EVER clean that GASH. It is PITIFUL, well, she is. #jodiarias
Uh Oh…. potty mouth!
boomer ‏@nuts2beanz 19m
@TerriStefaniw @JodiAnnArias this would be a great oxyclean commercial. Might even clean up that gash of hers #jodiarias
– Peer pressure!
ESNEET4113 ‏@esneet4113
RT“@debrasweet1959: @esneet4113 I’m not sure about that Dahmer was still loner not Manson” Manson was a manipulator just like #JodiArias
– When did Jodi Arias get into the same class as Dahmer , Bundy, and Manson? Since she killed her dog, like many serial killers do! Of course, why didn’t I allege that?
Vinnie Politan ‏@VinniePolitan 3 Dec
4pm on @HLNtv I will be talking about #JodiArias and her alleged threats against #JuanMartinez
– Because I have nothing factual and informative to talk about!
Michael Kiefer ‏@michaelbkiefer 26 Nov
Nurmi is saying that asking jurors for their Twitter handles is less intrusive than asking their address and phone number. #jodiarias
Retweeted by InconvenientTruthsTV
        – Michael Kiefer, the only fair reporter out there.
Another reason we wanted to draw attention to some of these tweets is because they are a precise blueprint for how to stalk and bully on the high –  tech Interweb.
Free speech is free speech. If you want to scream to the world that you are an ignorant fool, have at it.
bullyI don’t know the age of these people, but what are these people teaching their sons and daughters, sisters and brothers, or their children when they use  the social media to attack a person like this?
It makes people feel bigger when they can project their own evilness and sickness onto soneone they feel deserves it, and gain some friends for good measure. I am the coolest because I threw the biggest rock at Jodi Arias! miley smThe kicker is that Jodi will never see these Tweets.
 Great way to show us your naked cruelty, aggravation, and penchant for vengeance. Really Nice!
Great way to memorialize Travis!
So while these Twitter Twits of the Twitterverse are sharpening their claws on Jodi Arias, who are they stalking and attacking in real life? Who are they teaching to do the same?
These geniuses are pitiful, ignorant and  maybe a little bit funny if they weren’t so sad.

Genius #3

Jeffrey Martinson 9 years in prison: Case dismissed
Jeffrey Martinson 9 years in prison: Case dismissed

Maricopa, Arizona Prosecutors

PHOENIX, Nov. 20 (UPI) — “Citing “a pattern and practice of misconduct” by prosecutors, an Arizona judge has freed a man charged nine years ago in the death of his son.
Judge Sally Duncan dismissed first-degree murder charges against Jeffrey Martinson in the 2004 death of his 5-year-old son, Josh, and ordered the father be released Sunday, The Arizona Republic in Phoenix reported Tuesday.
jodi arias 88Duncan dismissed the charges “with prejudice,” meaning Martinson cannot be tried again on the same charges.
In a 28-page ruling, Duncan detailed what she called the prosecution’s “win-by-any-means strategy.”
Duncan said Deputy Maricopa County Attorney Frankie Grimsman charged Martinson with felony murder, then tried him as if he were charged with premeditated murder.”
Here we go with the felony murder vs. premeditated murder thing, again.
Let’s do a review.
wonder_woman 2Felony murder is usually when an unintended murder is a by-product of another intended felony.
You go to rob an empty home. Someone is unexpectedly there or shows up unexpectedly and you kill them. That’s felony murder,
You go to rob a bank and the teller has a heart attack and dies. This can be felony murder.
You rob a bank with a friend and the friend shoots and kills a cop. You and your friend  have both committed felony murder.
You rob a bank with a friend and the friend gets shot and killed by a cop. You have committed felony murder.
You go to a home to kill someone and after that, you decide to rob him. Tthat’s premeditated murder and a separate charge of burglary.
So, what happened in this case? Martinson was accused of child abuse and the death of his 5 year-old son. It was a death penalty case.
The prosecution theory is that Martinson abused and drugged his child many times, and one time when he was doing this, the child died.
The case was  presented to the Grand Jury, charged, presented to the court, and presented to the defense attorneys as a first degree felony murder. In the course of the defendant committing the felony of child abuse, the child died. The Aggravator making the case death penalty eligible was “ extremely heinous, cruel or depraved”, stating that it was depraved because it was a “senseless murder”.
super shopperShortly before trial, in spite of objections from the defense and warnings from the judge, the prosecution presented the case as a first degree premeditated murder.
This means that they must have discovered at the last minute that they couldn’t get a conviction on their original theory, so they changed it. But the prosecution did not inform anyone about this change, but they tried to hide it.
In addition, the aggravator of senseless depravity is not relevant to premeditation in this case. The prosecution refused to admit this error and violation of the rights of the defendant to know what crime he is being charged with .
This dismissed case was a Death Penalty case. The man was in jail and prison for 9 years. You do not play games when someone’s life is at stake.
If you have read some of the other articles on this site, you will know there is a clear pattern of “get the conviction at all cost no matter what the facts and the evidence are” in Maricopa. Arizona.
….and the mainstream media will never report about that!

(Thanks to SW, for this one)

Troy Hayden interviews Jodi Arias
Ryan Owens interviews Jodi Arias
Jennifer Willmott, Heroic closing argument

All comments are welcome and appreciated

All Rights Reserved






107 thoughts on “Heroes, Zeros, and Geniuses #2 Lights Out (Dec 8)”

  1. No, Nancy Grace was not any more fair to Martin MacNeill than she was to Jodi Arias. Unfortunately for MacNeill he has no one on his side, not a Michael Kiefer, not a friend or relative. I urge you to watch his trial, you will see things in a different light. Another bad verdict.

    1. I have missed you, Nav. I will say that “Gypsie” seemed to me to be the manipulator who came in the Doc’s life and seems to have led him around by the……nose.

      And she got away Scott free. I can meet you that far. I am willing to say that Gypsie murdered Michele using a weapon named Dr. MacNeil.

      If you get a chance sometime please check out our new site:


      I want to know what you think.

  2. I can’t stand the Gypsy, I’m with you on that. But if you assume she was involved you must assume he’s guilty, I’m not sure, I think not. Did she want Michelle dead? Probably. Was he upset about her death? Maybe not. I’m getting quite upset because I see where this is going, they won’t stop till they completely destroy him – he just tried to kill himself. Is he the husband/father of the year? He’s no prize. Is he a killer? Ask Todd Willingham.

    1. I just can’t see this as an accident, given what I have heard. Drugged and in the bath tub with her clothes on?

      I can accept that having affairs and not being happy in a marriage does not nec. mean you are a murderer. But, for me to agree with you, I would need to see how this was an accident.

      I did see the report about the attempted suicide. I guess we are both afraid he will make another attempt.

  3. ps. The MacNeill trial was more fascinating than Zimmie, you should watch it, it’ll give you a new cause I’m sure. And yes I’m checking out the new website now, you’re like the WebKing, getting out of control there RR…

    1. The Spotlight site is going strong. The American culture site recently started taking off. Still it’s really only a handful of viewers and very few comments.

      I should take a look at MacNeil. I saw very little of it.

      1. It’s online in it’s entirety. I feel this is a worse verdict than the Arias verdict, and you know what I feel about that. I think at least with JA we can be sure someone died at the hands of another person, that’s not so certain in the MacNeill case.

  4. pps. If you watch the trial (it’s a shortie compared to JA) then you will see the Gypsy is an amateur manipulator, Alexis is the master

      1. Here is a short synopsis of my theory: All of MacNeill’s daughters revered their father growing up, they strived for his love, attention, he ignored them (according to their own words). This is particularly devastating to a female child from a male parent. After the death of their mother, MacNeill throws Alexis to the curb to move the Gypsy in, the final insult. She gets enraged. Psychology is a powerful thing, it drives everything. Alexis, the ringleader, turns the entire family against him, an easy feat since Rachel is psychotic, Vanessa is a heroin addict whose sister is simultaneously her daughter and the rest of them are under-age. It’s interesting to note that the only member of the family who thought MacNeill was innocent was his only son, who committed suicide, what does this tell us?
        Let us now ask why MacNeill would have murdered Michelle rather than divorcing her. Ok, there’s the Mormon thing, maybe. The house and other assets were in Michelle’s name at the time of her death and there was no insurance policy to speak of. He didn’t even have money to pay for his lawyers who did this pro bono. A doctor/lawyer so stupid to get himself into this kind of financial jam? Maybe. Probably not. I find it hard to believe that a 50yr old woman let’s herself be coerced into plastic surgery, it’s possible but more likely she’s the one who wanted it – an ex beauty queen, middle age, afraid her fit husband may stray???
        Then there is the small details like the fact that the first mistress who testified against him was diagnosed with multiple personality disorder and they swept the US corrections system to get a number of felons (4) to testify against him, with ostensibly nothing to gain. There is evidence that the state tried to conceal making deals with these people. They certainly sold their soul to get the Gypsy to testify.
        They argued no concrete cause or manner of death. Nobody knows what she died of.

      2. Yes, Vanessa had a daughter which was adopted by the MacNeills, thereby making her her sister as well. Here is another piece of trivia (for a psychology buff), Gypsy also had a daughter who was adopted by her own parents thereby making her her sister effectively. Bizaare enough for you yet? Is it any wonder MacNeill and Willis were drawn to each other? The dynamics are beyond a Brazilian soap opera.

      3. Look at this family ok: Rachel; delusional psychotic, Vanessa; a heroin addict who’s daughter is her sister, Damien; committed suicide, four adopted daughters; one is Vanessa’s daughter, the other three from the Ukraine, Gissele gave an interview stating that she considered neither of the MacNeill’s as her parents as they treated her as a slave. Alexis has not been diagnosed with anything to date but should be. Gypsy Willis has been called a sociopath by her own sister, MacNeill’s first mistress who testified was diagnosed with MPD. Does this sound like a healthy bunch to you?

      1. What does this mean; It varied? This doesn’t worry you?
        The original Me determined the death of natural causes, she’s the only one who was not compelled to change her report (I know how you like changes ie; Horn) and who was not purchased off of Nancy Grace (as the prosecution’s star expert was).

      2. I understand what you are saying. It seems that bathtub deaths are very popular among police and Mormons. The cause of death was drowning. We need to look at the surrounding circumstances to see how she drowned.

  5. pps. There is no evidence she was “drugged” and nobody knows what she was actually wearing because he (MacNeill) didn’t make his small daughter go through the terror of testifying

      1. They also said he feigned administering her first aid based on the testimony of the paramedics who said there were a couple of cups of water coming out of her mouth when they started CPR. It was not mentioned much that the two neighbors who came over immediately (before the ambulance arrived) were doing chest compressions and he, Martin, was doing mouth to mouth. Water is expunged from a person from chest compressions NOT mouth to mouth. Have you heard this reported anywhere?

      2. Sorry Rob, what’s CNS?
        I think he’s a GP, he worked in some sort of facility with the mentally handicapped I believe. I don’t think he has a specialty.

  6. One of the daughters evidently accused him of sexual abuse, this charge was dropped before the trial, and now re-introduced. Is it starting to stink in Denmark?

      1. Yes now he has another trial coming up in Feb, sexual abuse. Guess which daughter is accusing him of that. No, not one of the young ones, it’s Alexis. Hmmm, sexual abuse, very difficult to disprove, particularly for someone who’s been convicted of crimes. Do you think Alexis knows this?

      2. Difficult to prove? She doesn’t have to prove anything, her word against his. Who do you think most people (who follow Nancy Grace et al) will believe? She knows this as sure as the Hughes and Hall know their shitty word is gold.

      3. You’re surprise she’s still going after him, that life is not enough for her? I think this is insurance. They know this verdict is flimsy and may get overturned. There isn’t even a cause of death. This should give you an idea of how manipulative Alexis is.

      4. “I wouldn’t take her word. I would need some evidence, witnesses from the time in question.” LOL
        Yeah well you’re not on the jury, the manicurist is….

  7. Evidently not. I heard her comment on his suicide attempt. She’s the Ice Queen. This is not about her mother’s death, it’s about rejection. She’s a classic sociopath and master manipulator.

      1. There is conflicting testimony on this, nobody knows. Alexis and Rachel said something about clothes thrown in the garage, the neighbors and paramedics said something else, and the then six year old daughter at the time had a conflicting story about the color and type of clothes as well. I think she had some clothes on. That’s not inconsistent with MacNeill’s story imo.

  8. Ok, now I know what you’re talking about, LOL, you think I went a bit over the top with the “sperm is a living thing” thing? LMAO
    wow did I get some hate mail there

  9. I think she had a heart attack, like a lot of 180 pound, 50 year old women who don’t exercise and have heart disease. The surgery may have precipitated this but it is not at all clear who’s idea the surgery was, contrary to what Alexis would have us believe.

  10. It’s a tough subject, all I know is that I know no woman who would like to have an abortion. Your comment was quite sensitive, in contrast to mine.

      1. I agree, I think that education and contraception is the only answer. Unfortunately the pro life right doesn’t seem to be hot on either of those.

      2. It is interesting that the two most practical ways to lower the rates of abortion are both demonized by them.

        This, like guns and illegal aliens, are Wedge issues, which no one wants to solve because they fire up the people to go out and vote.

      3. The other is more community outreach by religious and civic groups to show why life is a wonderful choice.

        And I am getting tired of the Nanny-Staters on the left, too!

  11. Having some clothes on is exactly consistent with a heart attack. She was running a bath and wammo. I’d be more worried if she were found naked in a dry tub like Drew Peterson’s wife.
    If he drugged her and then drown her, why take her pants off? What’s the point? If he killed her why be soooooh stuupid as to move his mistress in in a couple of days? Why do it while the house, a major asset, is in her name? Why go through the whole charade of plastic surgery when he knows pharmaceuticals which will kill her without a trace? Even amateurs have gotten away with that. Stupid plan
    It’s worth noting that he, like Arias, has no history of abuse or violence. Is he an a-hole? Yes

    1. It’s possible that on first running the water for a bath, that she had an attack and fell into the tub. But usually when you go back to the tub to get in, you are usually not wearing clothes.

      Also the 911 call. I think a doctor would do everything he/she could Before calling 911.

      1. You turn on the faucet, you take off your pants while the water is running, you plan on taking off the rest of your clothes but have a heart attack first…..
        If he came in and saw her face down in the tub, couldn’t lift 180lbs dead weight out of the tub, didn’t know how long she’d been there? I’d let the water out and call 911, then try to get help from nearby, that’s what I would do. That’s what he says he did. There were at least two witnesses who testified to seeing him (one at his work one at the kid’s kindergarten) in a time frame which would have made the prosecution’s timeline impossible.

      2. I’m guessing that most people who take baths do not take all their clothes off and then stand there naked for five minutes while the tub fills. They start the water, take something off, test the temperature, take something else off then get in. That’s consistent. What is not consistent for me is drowning her while 90 naked pounds of her are outside the tub. If I were to dope someone up to drown them, I would wait for the tub to fill, for her to get in on her own and then gently ease her doped up head under the water, she’d be completely naked. no signs of struggle, hard to prove. Not like this mess, this mess looks like a heart attack. Not that I have contemplated this before

      3. She was head first in the water? Nobody knows, the only two witnesses are the six year old and MacNeill who nobody believes. He says she was slumped over head first in, hard to decipher what the six year old saw AND she was coached by Alexis, a big no no (for anyone who’s seen even one episode of Law and Order). Of course I believe everyone was coached by Alexis.

      1. He was at work then he picked up the kid at the kindergarten, both places he was seen in a time frame which is inconsistent with having enough time to kill her, this was testified to by two witnesses, who had no horse in the race.

  12. Yes it’s scary, For the Grace of God There Go I…
    I think it happens everywhere, I think the only way to fight it is to question the party line

      1. I was optimistic until they wanted to hear the 911 tape (at five to midnight), their decision pivoted on this. The 911 call tells us nothing.

      1. Frankly, I think Randy Spence is one of the most effective lawyers I have seen, ever. Suznne Gustin, though she played a smaller role is also an excellent lawyer. I don’t think either one got paid. I believe they both believe in his innocence, I don’t think they did this for the (negative) publicity. To be honest it’s people like these two who restore my hope in the justice system (maybe even make me sorry I didn’t go to law school). What do you think of that?

  13. Imo, the most important part of the trial was the cross examination, which was very very compelling ( though obviously over the jury’s head), they impeached every single key prosecution witness. The defense didn’t even have much of a case of their own, their case was the cross. The closing statements were very good imo, yes there were charts but I found it very effective because for me the defense tied it all together and demonstrated what bs the prosecution’s case was built on, more than reasonable doubt. It’s worth noting that while the overwhelming majority of the public, as usual, thinks he’s guilty there is considerable doubt among the legal community (not that that’s key for me).

    1. I think we as jurors we have forgotten what we are supposed to do. It’s more based on who is more likable, who has the best “story” and tooo much on emotions.

      We are supposed to remain objective, look at the facts, check our emotions at the door, and hold to the standard of proof beyond any and all reasonable doubt.

      1. I think it’s not a question of forgetting, some people are not capable of checking their emotions because they don’t have the same critical thinking skills as you do. This is exacerbated by today’s mass and social media. It’s like during Bloody Mary of Tudor’s reign, but worse….

  14. Yes I do. But “most” is of little comfort when I’m being sent down for something I didn’t do. Also “most” can be an elusive number, it can mean 99.9% of the time or 70% of the time. I think they’re wrong a lot.

    1. The Graham case? Bizzare. She pushes him over a cliff because she “was unhappy in the marriage”? After nine days of marriage? I would understand it if this was the 1800’s or Yemen, but here we have a thing called divorce??? I don’t know that story is just too strange, the motive, if there was one, is beyond belief.
      Why is she being charged with first and second degree murder? How does that work?
      I think that mental illness is more pervasive than we suspect.

      1. Well, maybe she (Mormon) just doesn’t know her own strength. Maybe God had a hand in it?

        That’s how it works. They gave the jury a multiple choice test.

    1. Yes, and then she got the tub. Something very Mormon about death in the water or through the air. They need to get more creative. I appreciate that they are not shooting each other, though.

      1. Exactly. I think we really have to factor into this that this girl is a Mormon. Many of them are incredibly sheltered and naïve.

        So, given that, her story is possible that it was more or less a fight that got out of control and then she tried to put it out of her mind.

    1. I don’t think she planned it. I can understand why she lied about it. I would want to know more about what went wrong in those 9 days or ? days they were married.

      1. Yes, I don’t know enough about it either. But it doesn’t sound planned, hence the first degree question.

  15. What I know of the texts and emails I don’t find very compelling. What’s scarier, if true, is that they apparently found a blindfold by his body. The judge didn’t allow that in though.

    1. Who in the hell would put on a blindfold on a cliff? She should have just said it was a suicide pact, and she backed out at the last minute, LOL

      It was like 200 or 300 feet. That last step is a doozy.

  16. If you plan on pushing your husband off a cliff you should know the blindfold will be found down there (again, IF that’s true). If it was an accident then she should have called 911, I know 15 stories is a lot but people have been known to survive a fall from a plane when their parachute didn’t open. It would be a terrible way to die if it wasn’t instant. This is just another stupid story of a senseless death. Whether it was a murder or an accident it was completely unnecessary.

    1. Who knows if there was a blindfold. Maybe it was just a scarf or bandana.

      It’s abominable, and I don’t think she will walk away from this one.

      I thought they said this was at night???

  17. I think it was in the evening. If it was dark then the blindfold would have been double stupid. Who knows, maybe it was a fashion accessory.

      1. If if it was dark then she didn’t need to blindfold him, it’s like dressing a duck in a down jacket, double stupid. Anyway, the judge didn’t allow it in so it’s irrelevant, It’s just interesting

      2. Well, do you know what time this happened? Maybe she said “I have a big surprise for you. Close your eyes. keep walking…..keep walking….”

  18. I want anybody who have some knowledge on Guns and ammunition to explain that to me.

    the Bullet admitted into evidence, is 10 mm in diameter as presented in the picture meaning it was about 2/5 of an inch.

    But in the autopsy Dr. (Liar) horn stated under “GUNSHOT WOUND OF HEAD” section: “There is a 1/8 inch circular gunshot wound of entrance over the anterolateral lower right forehead, above the eyebrow” look here: http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Autopsy+Report .

    now I can understand that fact: a bullet what penetrates the skin and the soft tissue, the bullet could have stretched out the soft tissue in order to pass, and when it past through the tissue, the hole would shrink and will become smaller than the object what got through.

    but I cannot understand that fact: with regards the skull which is a hard bone, how can the hole be smaller than the object (bullet) what was going through?

    1. one possible answer….. the bullet never got through the skull…. backing up Richard Speights claims. http://www.herrspeightsventures.com/Innocence_Proof_of_Perjury.php

    2. another possible answer….. we have here another typo in Dr. horns report (Joke).

    3. another possible answer (Gun experts!!)….. the bullet got somehow deformed after passing the skull.
    but this is very unlikely that the bullet would get more than 3 times bigger after hitting the target, and furthermore its does not appear on the picture that the bullet was deformed we see a little deformation on the top of the bullet but in the bottom it looks to be quite in shape

    and even if in fact it was deformed after passing the skull but since a .25 caliber bullet is .635mm in diameter how can it create a hole of just 1/8 of an inch = just .3 in diameter

    Please give your answers and especially Gun experts!!

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